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I want to increase the int if it helps the creature take the vow, if it was an animal companion and because of it became smarter, why wouldn't it stay an animal companion? if it can learn to speak why cant it change its allignment to take a vow?

This is kind of growing beyond a quick question, but... You're asking too much of an animal companion. The druid & ranger abilities are (Ex), meaning completely non-magical. You are basically such an amazing outdoorsman, you find and train an animal and help make it extraordinary. The class feature says this: "A 1st-level druid’s companion is completely typical for its kind except as noted below." And noted below is what your companion gets, like more STR & DEX, extra tricks, etc. It does not gain the ability to speak, it does not gain an non-neutral alignment or the ability to devote itself to a high moral cause. It is just an animal that you have taught to be really amazing.

Now compare the paladin special mount. It is a (Sp) ability, already showing it is magical. The ability states: "Upon reaching 5th level, a paladin gains the service of an unusually intelligent, strong, and loyal steed to serve her in her crusade against evil." Then looking down at the chart below, it specifically shows INT increases. Also, it further states this mount is no longer an [Animal], but is now a [Magical Beast].

A familiar is somewhat similar. You have to perform a magical ritual to obtain one, they are magical beasts, and they are specifically indicated as gaining INT increases.

so what exactly does applying the ability score bonus from the bonus HD to Int do to an animal companion, or is that not allowed?

I would say it isn't allowed, personally. Animals specifically have INT 1 or 2. Increasing INT either is not possible, or it means the creature is no longer a true animal and thus cannot be a companion.

Animals are neutral because they don't live in a world of good and evil. If one becomes smart enough to understand such concepts and chooses to pick a side then I suppose it would be able to take a vow as a feat, though it would have to change its alignment first either through dedicated effort or magical assistance.

Remember that even with an Int of 3 or higher the animal still sees the world through its own eyes, ie prey and predator. True understanding of good and evil isn't something you understand from birth, you learn it over years of experience and that experience affects which side you will choose. A lifetime as a wild animal plus a few months, or even years, as an animal companion isn't going to teach you much about good and evil because you see the world as an animal does not as your master does. You won't necessarily understand why your master wants you to help him attack other creatures unless it's for food or defense of yourself, you do it because your master tells you to. Once you come to understand the motivations of your master, after gaining 3 Int or greater, then you can start to reconcile your memories of what you've experienced with concepts of good and evil or law and chaos. It's a process that would take a lot of time, and there's no way to ensure a specific outcome without someone to guide you down a specific path of reasoning.

So sure, get your companion to 3 int or greater and then spend years teaching it about good and evil and maybe it'll feel strongly enough about one or the other to take a vow. But the chances are small that any wild animal that becomes sapient would ever become so devoted to one or the other to qualify for a vow. They'll always remember that they grew up as a predator or as prey and in a crisis they'll likely fall back on those experiences to make their decisions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by harriel001 View Post
I know in the spell description for the Awaken spell it's stated, even in Pathfinder, that an awakened animal can no longer serve as an animal companion for a druid or ranger. I'm not sure if that applies to natural Int advancement as well as magically induced though. I suppose more research is required, or it's up to your DM.
True, but then again, awaken also adds 3d6 Intelligence, 1d3 Charisma, and +2 HD. So, even a 1 Intelligence reptile would have a minimum of 4 Intelligence, and with good rolls you could have genius-level animals, so not quite the same thing. And, of course, rule 0 always applies... that's the joy of pen-and-paper games, right? The ability for the rules to be adjusted for what works best for your particular game?

Does Awaken not change it to Magical Beast or something?
Point being, animals are not meant to get 3 Int naturally, and they sure as hell aren't going to take Sacred Vows.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFred View Post
Does Awaken not change it to Magical Beast or something?
Point being, animals are not meant to get 3 Int naturally, and they sure as hell aren't going to take Sacred Vows.
Yes, Awaken does change them into Magical Beasts.

The issue in question is that animal companions get attribute advancement points as they advance in HD through their owner's class levels. Can those points be spent to increase the Int of an animal, and if so does it remain an animal?

If it was my decision as DM I'd probably allow the Int increase, but it would take a lot of work to teach an animal good and evil or law and chaos to get it to shift alignments, and even once it knows the difference it may chose to remain neutral because that's what its instincts would dictate. I doubt greatly that a player would be able to convince me an animal would be willing or capable of taking a vow and then upholding it. I find it much more likely that an animal may be convinced to take a vow, but then would fail to uphold the vow and lose the bonuses and get really angry at whoever did the convincing. The whole process costing the animal a feat and causing a lot of stress between itself and its master.

Exalted Companion lets you have a Celestial animal companion (or other) with at least Int 3. Basically something good-aligned that is 'smart' enough to make these vows that can still get HD advancement from the Animal Companion class feature. Can they technically take Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty? I think so. Should this ever be allowed? No.

ahahah! thank you epimetheus. I understand why it shouldn't, a 30AC celestial flesh raker at level 8 is pretty damned scary, especially if you are riding it, both of you wearing monks belts with wilding claps, both with with improved unarmed strike, you with ashbound summoning, greenbound summoning, and natural spell, and the fleshraker with improved grapple.
shakey and inatentive flaws





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