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Shadowrun 6 is comming

   
Quote:
Originally Posted by AsenRG View Post
This actually applies to most systems I can think of.
Right but you get what I'm saying? 2-3 pages near the front of the book and you no longer have to care and can write the Lore outside of that as you wish. It's now on the party how moral or Amoral what there doing in character is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephirothsword117 View Post
Right but you get what I'm saying? 2-3 pages near the front of the book and you no longer have to care and can write the Lore outside of that as you wish. It's now on the party how moral or Amoral what there doing in character is.
Sure, of course I get you!

But maybe they wanted a balanced representation, or something. I can't judge them if they wanted that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knight of Holy Wor View Post
Shadowrun is a cyberpunk game, therefore a "punk" game so there is a theme of "fighting the man" or "the corrupt power".
Correction, that's one aspect of Shadowrun. Even looking at most of the archetypes in 4e and 5e, only a few of them are "cyberpunks." Most are borderline at best (possessing a Low or higher lifestyle, fake SINs, and Gold DocWagon contracts, and a total indifference/no-mention-at-all of the "good fight"), and not-at-all in several cases, such as the Covert Ops Specialist with their cushy high lifestyle, multiple fake SINs, and mercenary ethos.

Hell, if memory serves, the only sample archetypes in 4e that come close to being "cyberpunk" are the Hacker, Sprawl Ganger, and Street Shaman. Three out of something like fifteen examples isn't that great of a statistic.

Sure, the original premise for the game was "cyberpunk meets fantasy," but the setting has long since outgrown that narrow concept. It covers all sorts of genres with cyberware and magic just being facts of life in the gameworld. Even racism isn't really a major theme anymore. Sure, there's policlubs like Humanis, but they're about as common in the game as neo-Nazis are in the real world. Even the whole "cyberware makes you inhuman" idea has all been shoved to the sideway, especially once the developers realized how ridiculous it was to imply that anyone with a prosthetic was an inhuman, soulless monster.

In Shadowrun you can play a high class Face or Mage, a blue-collar DocWagon Paramedic or former Lone Star Cop, a former Hollywood Sim Actor or Stunt Driver, and all kinds of other non-cyberpunk concepts. You could also have campaigns focused on traveling to exotic locales, dealing with dragon or immortal elf politics (which includes several published adventures in fact), travel to other planes of existence, go on treasure hunts for things from Dunkelzahn's will, get involved with high class magical cults, and so on and so forth. And you've even been able to do those things since the very first edition of the game where the "cyberpunk meets fantasy" idea was strongest.

Basically what I'm saying is what I suggested in the first paragraph: Cyberpunk is just one small part of the game and setting. It is not the defining aspect of it; that's what games like Cyberpunk 2077 are all about. Shadowrun is as much William Gibson as it is J.R.R. Tolkien, Tom Clancy, J.K. Rowling, Neil Gaimon, and Terry Pratchett, just to name a few off the top of my head.

That said, I have very little interest in anything Cataclyst Labs produces for Shadowrun anymore. Once they started letting Internet fanboys from Dumpshock forums become the developers and writers for the game, it went downhill in a handbasket. They had very little understanding of what made the setting flavorful and fun, they dumbed down the mechanics hardcore, and with each edition since the 3rd have tried harder and harder to make it more restrictive and boring for the sake of "game balance." I cannot tell you how much I loathe the whole Limits system they included in 5e for that very reason. It's the P&P RPG version of only giving a character three or four abilities in an MMO because you can't figure out a more natural way to deal with munchkins and powergamers (as if that was your job to begin with). Feh!

Sure, the earlier editions had a ton of faults, but at least both the setting and the rules were fun and interesting, and whenever you got bored playing one general type of character you could pick something else and, blammo, you discover everything is new and and interesting, yet still the same somehow.

/RantFromShadowrunPlayerSince1989

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Scratch View Post
that's one aspect of Shadowrun.
Hence why I specifically said "a theme" and not "the theme". Of course it's just one aspect, but it a theme present in the game

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knight of Holy Wor View Post
Hence why I specifically said "a theme" and not "the theme". Of course it's just one aspect, but it a theme present in the game
Yes, but not a defining one either, which you were implying it was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Scratch View Post
Yes, but not a defining one either, which you were implying it was.
Again incorrect assumption on your part, I was not. I mention it because I was replying to a previous post where the topic was mentioned. The nutshell of my post is about the criminal mercenary nature of the role of shadowrunners in the Shadowrun world and the inherent amorality of this role.

So no, I made no such implication, I mentioned it but neither did, or was trying to make the implication.

So maybe the whole thing about canon characters being portrayed as bad people is to remind players, that Shadowrun, unlike the majority of RPGs, isn't necessarily a heroic one? That you can play heroic characters (or at least some that strife to life up to the ideals), but that the game in no way requires this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycar View Post
So maybe the whole thing about canon characters being portrayed as bad people is to remind players, that Shadowrun, unlike the majority of RPGs, isn't necessarily a heroic one? That you can play heroic characters (or at least some that strife to life up to the ideals), but that the game in no way requires this?
It's possible. Barring anyone having telepathy, though, we would probably never know what the developers were actually thinking.

OTOH, many if not most RPGs, especially those that aren't in the d20 family don't expect heroic characters, in the meaning of heroic that assumes that they're decent people fighting the good fight. Although there are whole swathes of the d20 family that don't expect it, either...

Don't get me wrong, some people do expect heroic characters in their games, no matter the genre! So your theory might be correct, especially if such people are having an oversized influence among Shadowrun fans at the moment.

I'm just saying we're not really likely to know. If the matter is ever raised, odds are we're going to simply get the publisher's answer, which might or might not coincide with the one the developers would give if NDAs weren't a thing!







 

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