Unique Gestalt Class Combinations - Page 2 - Myth-Weavers


Gaming Discussion

For all things gaming related.

Unique Gestalt Class Combinations

Here's one that we were discussing yesterday: pistol wielding gunslinger with juggler bard. Now you can constantly dual wield pistols.

A nasty summoning building: Half-orc (for ferocious summons) shaman with a dark tapestry mystery combined with the occultist arcanist. There's a hex in the dark tapestry that allows one creature of each summon spell to receive the advance temple. Multiple times per day, this build will be able to summon a ferocious, augmented,& advanced creature as a standard action.

Shining Star KnightClasses: Paladin || Monk
Archetypes: Enlightened Paladin, Tempered Champion || Scaled Fist

Huh. I guess the Cha to AC twice is nice and the combo certainly has flavor, but after you already made your pally into a monk/pally with Enlightened Paladin, I'd have looked for something more interesting on the other side.

Technically the Monk side can easily be replaced by something more flavorful. Scaled Fist was just an easy way to get Charisma to AC twice despite Pathfinder's usual penchant for banning adding the same stat to an ability twice.

I've always been a fan of Paladin || Bard for many reasons, but I'm sure folks can find more interesting mechanical combinations with Enlightened Paladin

I always thought Unchained Monk // Empyreal Sorcerer would be a good match up. You can also get some nice synergy with Monk//Magus.

It's worth noting that there was some kind of FAQ answer or something which said you never get the same stat to anything twice. The reasoning was nonsensical and IIRC it was by James Jacobs who as I recall demonstrably doesn't understand what he's talking about, but some DMs may choose to enforce it (even here; the funky way Enlightened Paladin works there's a strong argument against it, but there's a strong argument against it anyway).

Either way, depending on what you're after I'd be tempted to take only a single level of Unchained Monk (giving Unchained Flurry of Blows, Cha to AC and a bonus feat) and then multiclass into something else. Dervish of Dawn Bard (or Dervish Dancer, whichever gets the double bonuses) is a pretty good candidate as always or really any Cha-based class (e.g. Sorcerer, Oracle), whatever.

Yeah, I immediately thought of that FAQ and then went and looked at just how Enlightened Paladin actually works and wow. I can see the technical argument for how they should stack even if you follow that FAQ answer. It certainly is a wonky, rather non-standard way of creating that ability.
I kinda like the Dervish of Dawn idea, although you're going to need a custom deity if you also want the Way of the Shooting Star.

It's weird but because you're adding Cha to Dex, it means that the two combined is limited by armour (rather than just your Dex mod) - thus, even though you can wear light armour, you probably want to go completely unarmoured (maybe at the very low levels you'd do better with leather or something, but eventually it'll just hold you back). I'm guessing that's why they did it that way.

As for the technicalities of it, yeah, it's weird enough that it's plausibly not covered by that ruling - but at this point RAW starts to become (even more) irrelevant anyway. The FAQ isn't actually RAW and it's stupid anyway (the reasoning was that the stat is the source, and same source doesn't stack which is clearly not true - the source is the class feature, and the stat simply gives the magnitude, so this is like saying two +1s don't stack because the source is the number 1 - plus you get weird stuff like Fury's Fall where taking Weapon Finesse or Agile Manoeuvres actually lowers your bonus because you can stack Dex to Str but not Dex to Dex even when the second Dex is replacing Str and the first is a bonus, which is quite bizarre) so either a DM is probably going to agree with and be adhering to the intent of the FAQ (which is that stacking "X stat to Y" is too powerful, something there's a valid argument for which Paizo could perhaps have considered before publishing all the "X stat to Y" options that they did...) in which case they'll probably ban this too, or ignoring it in the first place in which case you're good to go regardless of the funky wording.


Yeah, Bard has some issues... actually Medium is pretty good (I think I already mentioned Medium). If you're gestalt, taking two martial classes just to be a slightly better martial feels a bit wasteful, because even aside from the fact that casters are better anyway (so you'll probably not even compare with straight-classed casters, let alone gestalt ones) there's a lot of overlap. However if you are going to do that, Dervish of Dawn Bard and Medium work really well because they add additional stacking bonuses on top (Medium is a bit like 3.5's Incarnate in this respect, actually). They also both diversify a character, adding spells and utility (Bard gets better spells, lots of skills, and a couple of other abilities, whilst Medium gets a small number of spells and some very niche utility - like the Haunts thing - but can switch to Archmage or Hierophant on off days for divinations or crafting or whatever).

At some point I really want someone to run a gestalt 3.5/PF mash-up so I can play a Medium|Binder.

Originally Posted by TheFred View Post
At some point I really want someone to run a gestalt 3.5/PF mash-up so I can play a Medium|Binder.
Admit it, that's just because you know nobody will have the slightest idea what you can actually do.

One thought would be to go with Witch|Wizard. Not exactly a grand creative idea, but if you grab the Healing patron then you get the healing/restoration line and debuffs from the witch side, plus all the various utility from wizard to have basically all, well most at least, of the spells.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Last Database Backup 2019-01-22 09:00:07am local time
Myth-Weavers Status