Is There A Pathfinder Tier List For All Classes? - Myth-Weavers


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Is There A Pathfinder Tier List For All Classes?

Is There A Pathfinder Tier List For All Classes?

Is there a Pathfinder tier list for all classes? I know there a D&D 3.5 Tier List. So I was just wondering if there's a Pathfinder tier list existed somewhere.

Discussion of tier lists is basically banned here. Too controversial, too many flame wars.

Well, as long as we aren't actually discussing tiers, I see no reason we can't point him in the direction of some resources.

This is an older list but pretty comprehensive.

This answer from RPG stack exchange is much more up to date.

Considering the Min/Max boards one was updated with the last book to introduce a relevant class outside of Vampire Hunter D, I'd say it's pretty recent.

@Raveled Still? That still hasn't cooled off after half a decade? Ugh.

It's more that they never unbanned it to find out if it were still controversial here. Can't say as I blame them.

Considering the vitriol of a Tier list argument, I can't say I blame them either.

It's been discussed a bit quite a few times without it ever really getting out of hand, though perhaps that's in part because of the ban (people won't go too far into any discussion about it), though I can't seem to find exactly which aspects are banned and which aren't. Essentially it's because you get dumb arguments about what is what tier (usually with different people using different definitions of "tier") and about how useful or useless the whole concept it.

I never really liked the idea of the tier system at first; I think part of it was not wanting to admit that certain classes are "better" than others, which I think is where a lot of people get angry. I think it's important to understand what it's actually trying to say, and also the limitations of that. It's still not a totally practical measure since so many different things can change even within a class (Pathfinder tier lists especially tend to have oodles of "only this archetype" or "except that archetype" entries on them, because many archetypes aren't far off brand new classes) and even "equivalent optimisation" can mean different things in different contexts.

When you actually start discussing specific classes things tend to get a bit more heated - that's probably just people not wanting to admit that their favourite class isn't the "most powerful" (not actually what it means, I know) or other people wailing on something unfairly.

Basically, I go back to the Venerable Captnq and his wise wise words: "The tier system is both brilliant and idiotic." His take on the Tier system is at the bottom of the first real post, and is worth reading.

I think that's about as far as we can take this thread, honestly. There's not much else to say that doesn't have the potential to become that which the mods hate.

I think one of the biggest problems is that Tier discussions almost always blur over into play style arguments (another subject banned for good reason).

They shouldn't, because the whole notion of the Tier system is to look at a fairly specific aspect of the game. It's just the same as if one option is strictly and provably mechanically superior to another - that doesn't say that mechanical superiority actually matters, only that if you measure that, this is the result you'll get. Saying that you don't care about the crunch because you're all about "role play over roll play" or some such doesn't alter the way the crunch is, it just means you probably aren't interested in that discussion.

However you're right, they usually do.

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