Worldly Talk

Civil discussion and debate on real world events and issues.

Congratulations Europe

Originally Posted by Gygaxphobia View Post
Congrats for not being invaded by Germans for 70 years! w00t

.... Germany is in europe....
Yep. Just because they all originate from a single continent, doesn't mean they're all of the same ilk. :P

That rule wouldn't apply to any continent, I don't think.

Germany actually runs Europe via the EU so the Third Reich might get it's wish after all (albeit 60 years after trying force).
But the ideology is all different so um... yeah. You should probably read into the politics a bit more before simply coming out and saying that.

Originally Posted by Charles de Gaulle; which I think means 'charles of gaul', which kinda sounds egotistical now that I think about it, considering it refers to france of the ancient world, and maybe even the name charles draws parallels to charles martel and charlemagne... okay, I'll stop...
At a news conference at the Elysee Palace in Paris, attended by more than 1,000 diplomats, civil servants and ministers as well as journalists, General de Gaulle accused Britain of a "deep-seated hostility" towards European construction.

He said London showed a "lack of interest" in the Common Market and would require a "radical transformation" before joining the EEC.

"The present Common Market is incompatible with the economy, as it now stands, of Britain," he said.

He went on to list a number of aspects of Britain's economy, from working practices to agriculture, which he said made Britain incompatible with Europe.
That actually sounds incredibly anti-britain in general and I don't think it contributes to the current situation. Who cares about agriculture and working practices? Isn't international trade just exports? Did he suggest that france should supervise british labor (something that no english person would go for, nor if it was any other country; especially in the 60s)? And isn't this just a matter of currency? You have your late 60s in my 2012s. >_>

Anyway however, I do agree that if the UK wants out though, they should get out. :P

A ruling body for mankind that connects as opposed to the national identities that create rifts between us.
True, but more steps need to be taken than simply a ruling body that exists. What would be needed for world governance? How would jurisdiction be established. In what ways would communication be streamlined (it's more than just the internet; who would provide internet service and what would be done about language and fundamental disagreements in terms of things like religion and even education, infrastructure, water, the expanding population in third world regions such as India and the africas, etc.). How would trade be facilitated by a singular currency (how are we even sure that the EU flourished under the euro? Not that I've actually studied into my self, because hell, I got better stuff to do).

as John Stewart put it , "Germany now rules Europe through an international conspiricy of bankers."

Originally Posted by Kaeso View Post
Meh, ever since Obama got the Nobel peace prize for....being Obama, it has been reduced to the status of "fun but useless trinket". I can't exactly say I'm proud of this European "achievement".
Well technically he got it for being elected President while being visible something besides Caucasian. That is a lot more of an achievement than just being alive. Still not really Nobel Prize worthy IMO though.

I thought he won it for not being Bush, and promising a change to international relations, which really he did make good on, if you consider how much our relations have improved with most countries durring his presidency.

I doubt it, unless you are illiterate. Though if you get your news from Fox you probably don't see how we are working more closely with leaders of other nations and have regained the international respect that George Bush squandered.

He improved non-Pakistani relations, more or less. Iran's more confident, but they also seem to be very cautious about it, too. Methinks Khomeini is not happy with Ahmadinejad, and there
emphasis on could
could be some big changes with the next Irani Prez.

I think you'll find that Obama has been the best thing for the USA on foreign policy ... EVER!!!

Since Obama came into power, every other country looks on the USA in a favourable light compared to the gunslinging Texans who have previously been in office.

I say that as an Aussie who is living in the UK ...

Also ... if you're talking EU -- Bosnia and Serbia are NOT member states of the EU.

As for the anti-UK sentiment shown by the Continental Europeans, once again as an Aussie, so not British, the UK do get screwed over massively by the EU ... and not only politically, but also in the European Song Contest.

~Sigh~ I hate to sound like the "I know some stuff guy" But.
I did serve in the military as a civil affairs guy.
And I do work for the D.O.D. (Defensive Mapping Agency- look it up)

And I really have to go with Noobiegamerplayer.
Obama if nothing else has done a steller job in Foreigner relations. (Also gave military personnel / veterans, back allot of the stuff that the Late Bush Era Stripped away in the way of benefits and G.I.Bill stuff)

The E.U. And Iran are always sore spots for me.
I mean because really short of starting a war. (If I where C.A.C. I would have already started a air bombing campaigne of some of the stuff) What is Obama suppose to do. (Or the EU for that matter)

And really what would George W.Bush have done? Nothing. Jack.
Want proof. Look at the Russian Invasion of Geogria. The only time in his stay in the white house I might have been happy to have a "Cowboy" In office, and he drops the ball. Not even a single F-22 shooting down a Russian bomber. (Which where dropping bombs in basically the middle of populated cities. I know I inspected the bomb damage)

Now that being said, I'm not calming that I would make a good present.

As for the note of Obama getting the NPP for being something over then white. I don't think so, incase you haven't noticed, the rest of the world was not that impressed by the fact. (A good number of NPP winngers are not white) And a good number of world leaders are not white. Now that being said I agree the awarding of it was questionable. (Go look up other NPP, some of them are pretty iffy before then)

My only real Impression of EU politics that I have gotten over the years, is that the UK doesn't have as much say as they should. And that France has less then they Should. (Before anyone starts on the French thing, France is basically the Military Powerhouse in the UE, and has been the most powerful nation in Europe for most of European History. EVERYONE would have lost the Germans at the start of WWII. And did in fact the French army was pretty much destroyed in the opening days along with the UK's army, the reason they get called surrender monkeys is because the Vicci French then Helped the Germans after surrendering)

I am however very interested in EU polotics and Iran because of Turkey. (Soon to be member) Because really disptie what most people think, middle easy polotics is not really Iran vs US. It's really Iran vs Turkey. (And there allies) With China on Irans side, And EU/US on Turkeys side. Which really is why I think that Iran is acting up.

Because the EU is basically a Second US (If you look at military power, spending power, population and so on, with a little less of a impresive (Much less) Military might) So turkey with backing from the US/EU is basically unstoppable from a Iranian standpoint. Because really what are China / Russia going to do? (EU stops buying Russian Natural Gas/Oil, they go bankrupt very quickly) - (US stops buying Chinese goods and stops oil from getting to China, China has 200 million new unemployed and runs out of gas in 60 days)

Really the point to wanting Nukes is that it makes you basically uninvadiable. (See North Korea) And really dose anyone with a brain think they are going to hand a nuke over (Well mean to) To Terrorists so they can blow up Israel? If so.. Then you just think you have a brain, Because really...

#1: Nuke explodes in Israel. (One of three things happens)
#2a:Israel nukes the crap out of Iran. (Yes they have nukes, the best ones we could afford to lose)
#2b:China/Russia Abandon Iran, and a EU/US/Turkey Invasion of Turkey Happens.
#3c:France/UK/US/Israel nuke Iran.

Really it's like the line from the Avengers. There is NO WAY, that plays out well in a way that's good for Iran.

Back to the EU.
Basically it plays out to be that Germany is over represented. (Buy maybe.... 20%? Just making that number up)
France is under. (Maybe 10%)
UK is under. (Maybe 20%)

Originally Posted by blackstarraven View Post
My only real Impression of EU politics that I have gotten over the years, is that the UK doesn't have as much say as they should. And that France has less then they Should. (Before anyone starts on the French thing, France is basically the Military Powerhouse in the UE, and has been the most powerful nation in Europe for most of European History.
Except the EU is not the UN, and not a military alliance, but rather an economic and political union. Why should it matter who has the most guns? In the US, the state with the highest number of state troopers (or whatever the closest thing to a state-scale military force is) doesn't get more of a say, either, does it?

If the union is mostly economic, then it stands to reason that the greatest economy has the greatest say - and what do you know, that's Germany, with a GDP roughly 1.3 times as high as France's. You can also look at the sheer number of Europeans represented by 'Germany' as compared to the others, but again Germany's is about 1.25 - 1.3 times as high as France.
If Germany, when expressing its opinion, does so representing 1.3 times as many people, then it's only democratic that every one of these people's voices have an equal value to that of Frenchman's, so that their collective opinion as voiced by the German representatives, accordingly, also weights 1.3 times as heavily.


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