9 hours ago, Rudra said:@Ryfte no, i wont allow that, having whips count as flail would be a significant change(a significant boost i'd say) a one handed reach flail would end up being better than polearms at polearms job
compare whip-flail+flail expertise+slide 1 to polearm+polearm momentum+push or slide 2, the former is significantly superior and easier to set up
However there is a workaround i would allow: if you pick Fighter Arena training class feature(dark sun) and select Whip and Flail as your arena weapons, then you can apply the flail expertise feat to whips (it's not entirely clear if the feature is meant to apply only the numerical bonuses or the whole feat, so i'll say it's the latter)
Its all good and that seems like a fair solution. I figured I'd ask as whips actually were in the flail group originally. For a number of years before their "errata" eventually, lol. That being said the default has always been just using the spiked gain or the kusari-gama. I was trying to go more for style over mechanics and get away from the routine spiked chain build with dual whips instead. You are 100% correct about the controller-like setup with feats of course but that's baked in with the spiked chain and kusari-gama as superior weapons than the whip already. *shrug*
Kusari-Gama (Superior Melee, Double Weapon, Dragon #404)
Prof: +2/+2
Damage: 1d8/1d6
Range: --
Price: 10gp
Weight: 3 lb.
Group: Flail, Light Blade
Properties: Defensive, Reach, Off-Hand
Edit: All this being said I'm considering a standard wizard controller anyways, lol. :D