I hope you're not waiting for me to post anything...

HP 18/18 | AC 17 (+19 with shield raised) Perception +4 | Fort +7 | Ref +4 | Will +6 Resistances cold 1 | Speed 25 feet Statblock Languages Common Skills Acrobatics +1, Athletics +6, Diplomacy +5, Intimidation +5, Lore: Demon +3, Medicine +4, Religion +4 Str +3, Dex +1, Con +2, Int +0, Wis +1, Cha +2 Items Hide, Backpack, Bedroll, Chalk (10), Flint and Steel, Rope, Rations (2), Torch (5), Waterskin, Soap, Religious Symbol (Silver), Healer's Tools, Crowbar, Alcohol (5), Signal Whistle, Clothing (Winter), Air Bladder, Climbing Kit, Wooden Shield (Hardness 3, HP 12, BT 6) Shield Block Melee Scimitar +6 (Forceful, Sweep), Damage 1d6+3 S Reach Spell Divine Prepared Spells DC 14, attack +4; 1st Heal, Heal, Heal; Cantrips Divine Prepared Spells DC 14, attack +4; 1st Magic Weapon, Bless; Cantrips Guidance, Stabilize, Light, Forbidding Ward, Bullhorn Additional Feats Pilgrim's Token, Wintertouched Human Additional Specials Anathema, Deity, Divine Font (Healing Font), Divine Spellcasting, Doctrine (Warpriest) Talyn gruned as Myriawen's attempt to control the men failed. She hated when her gut feels were right - but it kept her alive. She hoped no one would suffer from this. Talyn glanced quickly at Buttercup's tied knot, drew her scimitar and rushed forward to join the others intent on closing with the nearest enemy. OOC: Exploration Activity: Defend Reaction: Action 1:Draw scimitar Action 2: stride forward to join others Action 3: strice into position to attack OR raise shield if she can't close enough OR strike if she has already closed enough

Apologies team - crazy week last week. Bit of debate here - I haven't seen all teh reasons, but I'm with Kistler, if we're moving forward (ironic given I've been missing) I couldn't care less about mechanics/roleplay aspects that don't pan out as I had hoped.

😀

^ As long as one doesn't run into a Gunslinger. 😄 That is an interesting house rule, though.

There is a toned-down houserule i like that allows use of weapon proficiency for Feint and Intimidate once you have expert proficiency. I imagine it like that scimitar-weilding guy in Indiana Jones. It adds the Manipulate and Visual traits to the action.

Ah ... thanks for the reply. I was thinking about it in context of a rogue (thief) I'm working on for another Game. CHA kicks in due to Deception and Intimidate (together with Dread Striker) as ways to get flat-footed if flanking isn't available, but I wasn't thinking of the character as a traditional "Face." It would have been nice to have an INT-based way to facilitate Feint and Demoralize so one could better build up an INT-DEX thief. I know the Investigator is an option, but I tend to incline to more traditional Core classes.

That was completely home-brewed. I had been taking to a friend about making things less reliant on attributes and more roleplay friendly. The x -> y stuff from 1e is loved by optimizers, but sometimes it's really nice and flavorful. Is a big muscle shark intimidating regardless of his charisma? Are acrobats strong? Can intelligence let you think of lies so clever you don't need charisma to sell them? If you wanted to roleplay that stuff there was a skill feat that let you reallocate a skill's attribute. It may have been two skills after level 5 or something. I also allowed the selection of the saves you wanted proficiency advancements in, instead of what the class gave for similar reasons. I have toned down my houserules a bit now, partially because they're a pain to run.

Question for you: IIRC, in the Enmity Cycle, there was a scheme where one could use a feat (class, general?) and change the STAT dependence of a skill (or two?). Was that a home-brewed rule or a canonical option? If the latter, could you tell me what it was called? I know this wasn't really OOC relevant to this game, but I didn't want to put it in the "bickering" thread either.

Agreed.

I don't see the issue. The posts are **right** there, that's the order it happened in Egan shot, she talked, Gareth came out and attacked Qingalic rushed out and grappled. I'm not seeing any reason for confusion, or a reason to retcon previously posted actions. Let's just go with the flow rewinding the round is pointless let's carry on.

I can't speak for Gol'garath, but I thought that he and Qingalic went into action subsequent to Egan's firing. If that doesn't happen ... umm ...

Sure, whatever you want to do. I would've lost the readied action by then, and that wouldn't have triggered it. So forget the attack and lets keep going.

Egan - rather than roll, did you pick the one to the left or to the right? You are right you can't tell if the charm worked or not. However, to make sure we are all on the same page let's get the order of events correct. All of you, are your actions before or after Myriawens little speech to the strangers? If you all shoot and grapple first, then she probably doesn't make the whole speech. If after, then she basically asked you all to attack and off we go? Not, trying to make this difficult, I just can't wrap my head around her continuing to talk if you 2 are already attacking. I would rather play it that you both attacked after she asked for help and go on.

No worries, I didn't think you were implying anything, I was just being thorough. Charm says (just focusing on the pertinent lines) So literally it only changes the attitude toward the caster, and only ends if the caster attacks, but I've seen it used where 'you' is the collective, party, sense of the word too. IE., attitude of the creature is friendly toward the party, and if anyone attacks it, the spell ends. The former interpretation means the spell has very specific situational use. Single guard on a door? Send the bard forward to see if they can convince him to unlock it while the rest of the party hides in the bushes. Low on hp in a battle? Cast Charm on the big guy to keep him from attacking you (and only you). Maybe some niche application with preventing an enemy blaster from AoO strikes by sticking close to everyone? But if your party is with you it seems like that guard would just say "there's 5 enemy dudes here, I'm not letting them in no matter how much I like you", and the big enemy just has 5 other targets and keeps hitting. I would say the latter interpretation might be too powerful (cast on the boss and then just walk on by, or pause the battle to use treat wounds, refocus, then continue?) but it has the Incapacitation trait, which really limits its power for that.

I wasn't insinuating anything at all. I just happened to miss your specification of target as I didn't click on your OOC/Actions tab - so whilst I saw that you had designated a random target, I didn't know which was which. Thanks for pointing that out, however. As I play in two other PF2e games with a GM who prefers placing OOC and Actions into fieldsets rather than behind a spoiler, I have probably lost the habit of using and checking those other than for semi-permanent character data. In any case, with no tactical map here, hopefully GM will have Qingalic Stride to and Grapple whichever target seems the most "active" or can be reached in two Strides or whatever. Presumably being hit would remove any Charm effect in any case, no?

Yes, contingencies can always be tricky. I tried to be clear about what I was doing. It's an in-line dice roll and I declared what the values meant first (and never edited the post). Trying to be as fair as possible. Looking forward to seeing what happens next, but seems like you and ZG have a good idea to try and capture one of them now.

I suppose the point is that I don't know what actual results Eagan and Gol'garath had, so I had to write Qingalic's Actions with a degree of contingency to them. PS for In case you need this, for the Target to escape a grapple (i.e. remove the GrabbedYou're held in place by another creature, giving you the flat-footed and immobilized conditions. If you attempt a manipulate action while grabbed, you must succeed at a DC 5 flat check or it is lost; roll the check after spending the action, but before any effects are applied. condition), they will need to use the Escape Action: Note that Escape has the Attack trait, so would suffer from MAP. In that case, Qingalic's Athletics DC = 17 which would be their target to 'escape.'

Yes, I understood that and your random 1d2 roll. That language was for the benefit of the GM to explain what Qingalic was attempting to do in the situation. Though, tbh, I wasn't sure what "which one" actually meant - I took that to allow GM to say "this guy is 1, that guy is 2" and Egan hit ... 1. Did I miss clarification on which target was which?

I assumed I could not tell which was charmed and which wasn't, so i made a coin flip to see what happened. I rolled that i hit the one that was not charmed. Really up to if that is what happens or not, but it seemed fair.

Qingalic Mølgaard Qingalic MolgaardFighter 1 N Medium Dwarf Strong-Blooded Dwarf Humanoid Perception +7; Darkvision Languages None selected Skills Acrobatics +4, Athletics +7, Lore: Hunting +3, Medicine +5, Stealth +4, Survival +5 Str +4, Dex +1, Con +3, Int +0, Wis +2, Cha -1 Items Hide, Healer's Tools, Backpack (2), Bedroll, Chalk (10), Flint and Steel, Rope, Rations (2), Torch (5), Waterskin, Soap, Grappling Hook, Wooden Shield (Hardness 3, HP 12, BT 6) AC 17 (+19 with shield raised); Fort +8, Ref +6, Will +5 HP 23 Shield Block Trigger While you have your shield raised, you would take damage from a physical attack. You snap your shield in place to ward off a blow. Your shield prevents you from taking an amount of damage up to the shield’s Hardness. You and the shield each take any remaining damage, possibly breaking or destroying the shield. Attack of Opportunity Trigger A creature within your reach uses a manipulate action or a move action, makes a ranged attack, or leaves a square during a move action it’s using. You lash out at a foe that leaves an opening. Make a melee Strike against the triggering creature. If your attack is a critical hit and the trigger was a manipulate action, you disrupt that action. This Strike doesn’t count toward your multiple attack penalty, and your multiple attack penalty doesn’t apply to this Strike. Speed 20 feet Melee Guisarme +9 (Reach, Trip), Damage 1d10+4 S Melee Clan Dagger +9 (Agile, Dwarf, Parry, Uncommon, Versatile B), Damage 1d4+4 P Melee Light Hammer +9 (Agile, Thrown 20 ft.), Damage 1d6+4 B Melee Fist +9 (Agile, Finesse, Nonlethal, Unarmed), Damage 1d4+4 B Ranged Javelin +6 (Thrown), Damage 1d6+4 P Sudden Charge (Flourish, Open) With a quick sprint, you dash up to your foe and swing. Stride twice. If you end your movement within melee reach of at least one enemy, you can make a melee Strike against that enemy. You can use Sudden Charge while Burrowing, Climbing, Flying, or Swimming instead of Striding if you have the corresponding movement type. Additional Feats , , House of the Musk Ox (Totem: Bighorn Sheep) Strong-Blooded DwarfYou gain poison resistance equal to half your level (minimum 1), and each of your successful saving throws against a poison affliction reduces its stage by 2, or by 1 for a virulent poison. Each critical success against an ongoing poison reduces its stage by 3, or by 2 for a virulent poison.; Megafauna HunterYou have a natural knack for tracking and taking down big game such as moose, saber-toothed tigers, and even wild mammoths. Choose two ability boosts. One must be to Strength or Dexterity, and one is a free ability boost. You're trained in the Athletics skill, and the Hunting Lore skill. You gain the Titan Wrestler skill feat.; Fighter (1) HP: 23/23 | AC: 17 (19): hide (shield) | Speed: 20' | Darkvision | Lang: Hallit, Dwarven Perception (E): +7 ▪ Initiative: +7 | Fort (E): +8 | Ref (E): +6| Will (T): +5 | Hero Pts: 1 | SkillsTrained: Acrobatics (+4); Athletics (+7); Lore/hunting (+3); Medicine (+5); Stealth (+4); Survival (+5) Untrained: Acrana (+0); Crafting (+0); Deception (-1); Diplomacy (-1); Intimidation (-1); Nature (+2); Occultism (+0); Performance (-1); Religion (+2); Society (+0); Thievery (+1) | AttributesSTR +4 DEX +1 CON +3 INT +0 WIS +2 CHA -1 | AttacksUnarmed: Fist +9/+5/+1 • Expert +5 • Str +4 • Item 0 • Damage 1d4+4 B • Agile; Finesse; Nonlethal; Unarmed Melee: Guisarme +9/+4/-1 • Expert +5 • STR +4 • Item 0 • Damage 1d10+4 S, Reach, Trip Clan Dagger +9/+5/+1 • Expert +5 • STR +4 • Item 0 • Damage 1d4+4 P, Versatile B, Agile, Dwarf, Parry Light Hammer +9/+5/+1 • Expert +5 • STR +4 • Item 0 • Damage 1d6+4 B, Agile, Thrown 20' Ranged: Javelin +6/+1/-4 • Expert +5 • DEX +1 • Item 0 • Damage 1d6+4 P, Thrown 30' Light Hammer +6/+2/-2 • Expert +5 • DEX +1 • Item 0 • Damage 1d6+4 B, Agile, Thrown 20' | Qingalic muttered a dwarven invective. Why the #### couldn't she have just waited? The two trappers likely might have walked right into an encirclement. He wondered whether this was going to be a problem for the future. OOC To be honest, I'm not clear now on the tactical situation. Did Egan hit the charmed one and Gol'garath the other? Or the other way around? Can Qingalic even tell which one is charmed vs. not? His intention would be to close with the one NOT charmed, or the one seemingly more "active" target and attempt a Grapple Attack (this would be +7 on an Athletics Check (I'll roll that here subsequently) against the TARGET's FORT DC. He will use a "release" free action to hold his guisarme in one hand so that he has a free hand to make the Grapple attempt. Another complication is the distance. Can Qingalic reach the target with a single Stride (20' for him) or does it take x2 Stride Actions? ... Ok, a 21 is almost surely a success (Qingalic's own Fort DC = 18), but not a critical one. So the target should be "GrabbedYou're held in place by another creature, giving you the flat-footed and immobilized conditions. If you attempt a manipulate action while grabbed, you must succeed at a DC 5 flat check or it is lost; roll the check after spending the action, but before any effects are applied...." This means and until the end of my next turn. Well ... hahahahah at the Demoralize attempt ... fortunately, there is no failure/critical failure result for that! Even assuming Q doesn't need both Strides to get into range for the Grapple. So the Demoralize either didn't happen or didn't work. ACTIONS Free Action: Release (one hand) from guisarme 1. Stride; 2. Stride (if needed) otherwise Athletics (Grapple), then; 3. Grapple; or if Grapple on Action #2, then 3a. Demoralize (since I'm holding my guisarme in the other hand, I couldn't think of anything else as one hand has to maintain the grapple)

Gol'garath, Ox House Spear-bearer AC: 18 | HIT POINTS: 16 | CURRENT: 16 | HERO POINTS: 1 0 FORTITUDE: +3 | REFLEX: +9 | WILL: +6 | PERCEPTION: +6 ACTIVE EFFECTS: Avoid Notice CONDITIONS: None Gol'garath lay concealed in the grove, his Musk Ox brother across the trail from him, the unknown hunters would be forced to leave the tight confines of the grove along the path moving right past the two concealed warriors, allowing them the opportunity to overhear their conversation, perhaps deduce to which Following they belonged and end the mystery of these strange hunters who encroached upon the Broken Tusk migratory routes. However, before their plan could bear fruition, Myriawen recklessly approached the pair, drawing their attention, unwanted as it was. He shook his head, rolled his shoulders, this was not the outcome he desired but it was the situation he now found himself in. He moved swiftly, watched as Egan's arrow erupted into the first's chest, he diverted moving towards the second attacker, he roared a challenge in the whooping style of the Musk Ox hunters, hoping the frightening display would cause his opponent's focus to waver, he then leapt into the air, reversed his grip on the spear and swung the butt of the weapon towards the poacher's skull. Out of Character Free Action: Reaction: Action 1: Charmed foe. Action 2: Stride towards Charmed foe (30 (35) ft if Demoralize successful) Action 3: Strike (or Confident Finisher if Demoralize successful); Non-lethal

I honestly don't know what you mean. The point is to have fun. Bard walks in think she'll charm her way through. Classic. It only works half way. She calls for help. Archer pins the first guy. Rest of party easily sees that and rushes in to save her. Good stuff. Crack open a flagon of mead and party. Seems like a perfect tabletop encounter, and I'm not sure what you're seeing that I'm not.

You know full well that is not the point. Qingalic probably thinks she has it all under control and will have a snack.

She is asking you to do just that in her last post. Let's Goooooo!