Star Trek Adventures: Two questions for the perspective players.

[DecoyGirl]

So Wile I have the concept for a upcoming Star Trek Adventures game done out.
I do have two things mulling around in my mind.
 

#2: NPC vs PC Captain.
This one is pretty simple, how do the players generally feel about the role of the captain and if they should be an NPC or a PC?

#1: What ship.
A bit more complicated.

In so much as I know what we need the ship to do.
The ship is star trek is honestly as much a character as anyone else so I feel like a discussion as to what we should use is a nice one.
I would even be willing to take suggestions as to ships I didn't think about.

Basiclly a "Light" exploration ship.
Which is to say something smaller then a galaxy that can be used for exploration that wont be out for years on end.
Something Size 5 or so.

Something like any of the following.
Excelsior Class (You can do a lot with a refit)
Ambassador Class. (Same)
The Luna Class or Nebula can work because of the Mission Pods.
The Obena and Parliament Class if you have all the box and netstuff (Its also on the character creator)
Also the Steamrunner might work as the only Size 4 on the list that might.
Intrepid Class. (As someone has mentioned it)


https://sta.bcholmes.org/index.html

Basically the ship needs Okay science and good sensors and to not be a push over.
Or be clearly built for something else.

Edited December 10, 2023 by DecoyGirl (see edit history)

[Heretic Burger]

Given that I'm yet to run/play STA (or fully assimilate the rules mentally) take my answers with a grain of salt as you choose.

 

I would very much say NPC captain, having a PC being able to pull rank to that extent is a recipie for disaster.

My immediate thought for the ship that vaguely matches the needs listed is an intrepid class. Although that might be a bit on the nose!

[DecoyGirl]

2 hours ago, Heretic Burger said:

Given that I'm yet to run/play STA (or fully assimilate the rules mentally) take my answers with a grain of salt as you choose.

 

I would very much say NPC captain, having a PC being able to pull rank to that extent is a recipie for disaster.

My immediate thought for the ship that vaguely matches the needs listed is an intrepid class. Although that might be a bit on the nose!

The only issue with the Intrepid class is that in the game it's a size 4 ship.
Which makes it a bit fragile.
Also it's more stated as a "Science" Ship and less and actual "Exploration ship."
But I had considered it.

[Roughtrade]

3 hours ago, Heretic Burger said:

I would very much say NPC captain, having a PC being able to pull rank to that extent is a recipe for disaster.

I've been in dozens of iterations of Trek Games, and no matter what the system, this has rarely been a problem. Trek set-up tends to be Officers and Department Head centric. I don't know what the other 400 crewmen are for, except as hostages. In any game using any system you might have someone try to bully their way into telling other players what to do. No one puts up with it there. A Captain PC in a Trek Game shouldn't 'pull rank' without sufficient reason, and if he does... well, that is part of the setting. Someone has to have the final word. Why are you arguing with the Captain to begin with?

That Said, an NPC Captain gives the GM a stronger voice for directing the action without it seeming to be a 'railroad' created by exterior forces. The early SIMs I played in had strong PC Captains and the way they ran, there really were not GMs. Everyone sort of contributed to the plot and a strong PC Captain was required to keep things from going scattershot in a dozen plotlines. Having an NPC Captain fulfills the same purpose; keeping everyone on task instead of canoodling in their staterooms with one another.

I like to play Chief Engineer or a Science Officer, being in the Captain's Chair was never something I felt like would be fun. With "Lower Decks" being a thing, a game could be done with all junior personnel and it would require an NPC Captain.

5 hours ago, DecoyGirl said:

#1: What ship.
A bit more complicated.

It doesn't have to be. The deck plans and ship layouts did not exist until after TOS was well into syndication. Sometimes by not having a solid layout of the ship, you can have more room to write. If you can find the old James Blish adaptations of the TOS episodes, there is some fun stuff. Like Kirk and Spock doing Zero-G workout in a void space which has Zero-G only because the gravity generators and the structural integrity fields had a weird interaction in a location.

Maybe your setting is a new class of ship. Smaller in size but sturdier for duty in hazardous exploration space. Toughened against ion storms and able to negotiate better within nebulas than other ships because of advanced sensors.

[hakootoko]

Since you're working on an exploration ship, I offer the following:

A training/exploration mission with a highly experienced, (NPC), captain close to retirement and a number of young and upcoming officers in various departments. In meetings he listens to the opinions of the others and sometimes has to pipe in to choose between them. He doesn't go on away team missions unless protocol requires him to. He gives his officers leeway to make their own decisions, and only steps if they're about to make a grave mistake.

I would prefer the smallest ship you think is sufficient.

[DecoyGirl]

7 hours ago, hakootoko said:

Since you're working on an exploration ship, I offer the following:

A training/exploration mission with a highly experienced, (NPC), captain close to retirement and a number of young and upcoming officers in various departments. In meetings he listens to the opinions of the others and sometimes has to pipe in to choose between them. He doesn't go on away team missions unless protocol requires him to. He gives his officers leeway to make their own decisions, and only steps if they're about to make a grave mistake.

I would prefer the smallest ship you think is sufficient.

Oh the actual set up for it is going to be a a Exploration into the Rolar Nebula region.
Basically it's a area of space between the Badlands, Tzenkethi, Breen, Cardassian and Ferengi.
Not that far from either the Federations boarders or a number of allies, but largely left unexplored because of tensions with the Cardassians over the years.
Games starts eight years after the end of the dominion war. So the federation is going to launch a cooprative exploration mission were the Cardassians are at least not antagonistic and the Ferengi are kind of cooperating.

Half exploration in your own back yard, half diplomatic exercise trying to get along with your next door neighbors.

As for the ship and crew.
I was going back and forth between the idea of a pretty substantial ship left over from the Dominion war, refit for use in the role.
Or a brand new ship made for the role.

I am leaning more to the concept of using a purpose built new ship like the Obena.

[DecoyGirl]

8 hours ago, Roughtrade said:

I've been in dozens of iterations of Trek Games, and no matter what the system, this has rarely been a problem. Trek set-up tends to be Officers and Department Head centric. I don't know what the other 400 crewmen are for, except as hostages. In any game using any system you might have someone try to bully their way into telling other players what to do. No one puts up with it there. A Captain PC in a Trek Game shouldn't 'pull rank' without sufficient reason, and if he does... well, that is part of the setting. Someone has to have the final word. Why are you arguing with the Captain to begin with?

That Said, an NPC Captain gives the GM a stronger voice for directing the action without it seeming to be a 'railroad' created by exterior forces. The early SIMs I played in had strong PC Captains and the way they ran, there really were not GMs. Everyone sort of contributed to the plot and a strong PC Captain was required to keep things from going scattershot in a dozen plotlines. Having an NPC Captain fulfills the same purpose; keeping everyone on task instead of canoodling in their staterooms with one another.

I like to play Chief Engineer or a Science Officer, being in the Captain's Chair was never something I felt like would be fun. With "Lower Decks" being a thing, a game could be done with all junior personnel and it would require an NPC Captain.

It doesn't have to be. The deck plans and ship layouts did not exist until after TOS was well into syndication. Sometimes by not having a solid layout of the ship, you can have more room to write. If you can find the old James Blish adaptations of the TOS episodes, there is some fun stuff. Like Kirk and Spock doing Zero-G workout in a void space which has Zero-G only because the gravity generators and the structural integrity fields had a weird interaction in a location.

Maybe your setting is a new class of ship. Smaller in size but sturdier for duty in hazardous exploration space. Toughened against ion storms and able to negotiate better within nebulas than other ships because of advanced sensors.

Ya in most every game I have played with the captain as a PC it's been fine.

You hit the nail on the head, the Captain being a NPC is more about having the GM give more narrative control.

It's the difference between letting it be a sandbox or a narrative.

[cybersavant]

i've played in ST games over the years [ many systems ] - always with a PC Captain. Never any problem. Oddly enough, we always seemed to have trouble getting a player to take the role. NPC Captain was always seen as more or a railroad game - "go here, do that" PC doesn't know what's going to be encountered. If it's stated outright at the beginning, those uncomfortable with a PC in that role won't apply.

 

I'd say, maybe have a private questionnaire for the Captain player, to see if they're a good fit.

[Inquisitor D]

I'm curious: is there any precedent for the Federation refitting ships of other races and bringing them into Starfleet? I can think of a few instances that're close to that: experiments with captured Birds of Prey and the use of Terok Nor as Deep Space 9 rather than building a new station, but I don't think we've ever seen a Starfleet ship that was originally built by a non Federation race.

Dunno if anyone else'd be into in that, but I find the idea a little interesting. :) Going on more conventional ships, I'm partial to the Obena and the Steamrunner, though anything could rock. If you're down with my idea of an alien ship, I kinda like the idea of us trying to use a Klingon Negh’Var or Vor'cha to try and do standard Federation exploration.

And I'd lean PC Captain. An NPC Captain is likely to sorta feel a bit distant from the group, an immediate authority who sits back on the ship while we do our thing. The classic Trek vibe of the Captain getting involved with the narrative and that complicating things works better with a PC.

Edited December 11, 2023 by Inquisitor D (see edit history)

[Heretic Burger]

You're all having much different gaming experiences than me...which is equal parts depressing and uplifting!

Edited December 11, 2023 by Heretic Burger
grammar (see edit history)

[Excior]

On 12/10/2023 at 5:34 AM, DecoyGirl said:

So Wile I have the concept for a upcoming Star Trek Adventures game done out.
I do have two things mulling around in my mind.
 

#2: NPC vs PC Captain.
This one is pretty simple, how do the players generally feel about the role of the captain and if they should be an NPC or a PC?

#1: What ship.
A bit more complicated.

In so much as I know what we need the ship to do.
The ship is star trek is honestly as much a character as anyone else so I feel like a discussion as to what we should use is a nice one.
I would even be willing to take suggestions as to ships I didn't think about.

Basiclly a "Light" exploration ship.
Which is to say something smaller then a galaxy that can be used for exploration that wont be out for years on end.
Something Size 5 or so.

Something like any of the following.
Excelsior Class (You can do a lot with a refit)
Ambassador Class. (Same)
The Luna Class or Nebula can work because of the Mission Pods.
The Obena and Parliament Class if you have all the box and netstuff (Its also on the character creator)
Also the Steamrunner might work as the only Size 4 on the list that might.
Intrepid Class. (As someone has mentioned it)


https://sta.bcholmes.org/index.html

Basically the ship needs Okay science and good sensors and to not be a push over.
Or be clearly built for something else.

No Constitution class ship? they may have renamed it to Enterprise class during TNG ara can't remember.

Constitution Class Star Ship

 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Excior (see edit history)

[DecoyGirl]

5 hours ago, Excior said:

No Constitution class ship? they may have renamed it to Enterprise class during TNG ara can't remember.

Constitution Class Star Ship

 

There is no entry in the games books for a Enterprise class.
In canon, that's just not a thing.
No Constitution was still in use by the time you get to TNG.
And there was no ship that was just a "Upgraded Constitution."

What you are most likely thinking of is the Constitution III class.
Which are new hulls built that look a ton like the older ship.

The issue with using that is that they are not built until about the year 2390.
Basically the 2nd season of Picard.
We are starting a few years before that, so it's not like that's totally out of the question.

And she is a VERY pretty ship.
So maybe?

[Inquisitor D]

Wait... there's the Constitution class, the Constitution III class... was there not a Constitution II?

*checks*

Ah, interregnum between the two, replaced around the 2350s by the Excelsior Class.

(And yes, very pretty ship. :) )

You know, all this talk has me curious. Would this ship be newly commissioned, a fresh crew going out for their first ever voyage together? Or would it be more... not veteran, but established? They've done a few years together, everyone knows each other already.

[Excior]

I dont know how to play the game but it looks interesting.

 

I thought at some point the Constitution class Star Ship was reclassfied Enterprise class because of the fame Enterprise got. I thought they did that some time around the same time the USS Excelsior was commissioned

[DecoyGirl]

1 hour ago, Excior said:

I dont know how to play the game but it looks interesting.

 

I thought at some point the Constitution class Star Ship was reclassfied Enterprise class because of the fame Enterprise got. I thought they did that some time around the same time the USS Excelsior was commissioned

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Constitution_II_class

That's likely what you are thinking of.

The Enterprise-A is a Constitution-II class.
Again, nothing has ever been called a Enterprise class.
As a side note, as far as we know... the Enterprise-A is the only Con-II class we ever see.