How much lore should I Give?

[ice9004]

I am looking to create a game based on Ratchet: Deadlocked, and was curious about how much setting information I should give in the Ad.

I'm worried about overwhelming potential players but feel if I don't give any info I'll isolate players.

[OzzyKP]

In general, I tend to like lots of lore. I like making characters that are well rooted into the setting. If the setting isn't fleshed out very well I have trouble really connecting with the game. Of course, that's why I like games set in Golarian or the real world, places where I don't have to learn a whole new imaginary history.

The question is how does the lore impact the game, and what relationship the characters have to the lore. One game I'm in, which has been going for 11 years now, had very little lore at the start, but we've been uncovering more and more of the lore as we've played. It is like a mystery that we keep exploring and it is part of the draw for me to keep revealing more and more.

But I'm sure most players aren't as motivated by lore as I am (and I am often turned off by a setting that doesn't interest me), so make of this what you will.

[yxanthymir]

Just give the basic lore, so they understand the world and then you can start to drip feed new information. Too much information at the start can be overwhelming and also really boring if you are not truly invested.

I myself skipped games I wanted to play, because there was more than 40 pages of lore, and I really didn't have the time or energy to read everything.

[cailano]

They'll need enough to create their characters and get rooted in the story.

You can do this with surprisingly little information. For example, if I was setting up an RPG based on the movie Alien, and for some reason most hadn't seen it, I might do something like this:

***

In the bleak cold of space, truckers scratch out a living hauling goods from world to world. Meanwhile, the Colonial Marines do what they can to maintain order and the common man labors nearly forgotten in the vast territory of the United Americas. So much remains undiscovered. So little is known of the "settled" worlds, and the Company's atmospheric processors mint new ones every few years.

In space, there are few comforts. Crews must be self-reliant above all. In space, the Company risks ships and crews without hesitation so long as there is a chance for profit. Half of their operations are secret, and even if help is available, it could be millions of miles away.

In space, you're on your own.

In space, no one can hear you scream.

***

It's quick, gives the information players need to start thinking of characters (or at least to ask good questions) and sets the tone for the campaign. The less you write, the more your players will remember!
 

[CharmingSatyr]

I like a hybrid approach between cailano and ozzykp. In the initial advert, there should be enough info to convey tone and allow players to create characters that fit into the world.

But I like having a separate area full of lore and details for those players that like to take deep dives into the lore. Plus, I'm usually prepared to expand on that info because players inevitably find that one obscure little hint and want to build an entire history/clan/faction around it.

[yxanthymir]

On 12/12/2023 at 8:03 AM, yxanthymir said:

Just give the basic lore, so they understand the world and then you can start to drip feed new information. Too much information at the start can be overwhelming and also really boring if you are not truly invested.

I myself skipped games I wanted to play, because there was more than 40 pages of lore, and I really didn't have the time or energy to read everything.

Just complementing myself here. I skipped the game, because the player took all that trouble and I could not read it all. It seemed kind of disrespectful of all his work to apply.

[TheFred]

I'm relatively ambivalent on the lore writ large - often you can provide lore that the players don't actually need, but can use if they want to. However, I'm pretty big on having a good bit of information about the start point of the game - the "hook", as it were.

I guess you can think of it in tiers. The lore close to the start/the players (whether in time or space) needs to be detailed; the lore of the big wide world usually doesn't. I probably don't need to know that the Emperor of the such-and-such place that this game probably won't even visit always wears orange on feast days. I probably do want to know how unusual it was that our characters formed and adventuring party, which tavern we're starting our adventure in, who hired us and why, that sort of thing.

Too often in my opinion people give a great vibe for the setting but then the hook is like: just make your characters, they know each other, they're in this location for whatever reason, their motivation is probably... like, money? It makes it hard to come up with a character who is well-integrated into the setting or even necessarily all that interesting at all because you've not got a lot to go on.

[Kuri_kun]

My general rule of thumb is write as much lore as you think the game needs. It varies from game to game. If you're running a dungeon based around an ancient sword meant to slay dragons then you really dont need all that much lore. The weapons lore, the locations lore, maybe some lore about the various groups that have used it or may want it. However if youre running a ghost story you want lots of lore, you want an interesting character to be your primary antagonist, you probably want lore about the location they haunt, you might want lore about their relationships in life, about their desires, their profession, and how they died, and most of all what unfinished business caused them to rise again. All of that lore should culminate together in ways to fight it, allergens, haunting profiles, and most of all the secret way to put that restless soul to rest forever

That said if you're making an advertisement for your game I just like to put in the cliff notes. Give the potential players an idea of what the game is, how it runs, what the setting is, etc Be honest and a bit detailed. For example you dont want to attract combat loving players if youre doing a deep political intriuge based game.

You can always make a thread in the game to do a lore dump. Lots of people will go read it but there will be some that just dont care or cant get into it but that way its there is people want to find out. That said some of your lore should be mysterious because nothing gets our brains more curious then a mystery. Let them uncover that mystery as the game progresses

[cailano]

I'm contemplating a fantasy sandbox campaign right now where all I'm going to disclose is the name of a few gods (and only if the party has a cleric or druid) and the name of the inn they start at. If there is anything else the PCs want to know, they'll have to go out and discover it.

[Roughtrade]

4 hours ago, cailano said:

If there is anything else the PCs want to know, they'll have to go out and discover it.

So, this is like someone born in America but not knowing where the next state is or what their religion is or how to work a toilet?

 

Some basic campaign information should be available to everyone. And a scholarly wizard should know more.

Despite terrible myths to the contrary, the average medieval peasant knew that the earth was round, spoke multiple languages, and knew both christian religion basics but also could tell you local tales of nature spirits and old gods of their homeland. They knew foreign lands; if for no other reason than their local rulers wanted to rile them up as levies when they went to war. Gota keep your troops mad at someone.

[cailano]

5 hours ago, Roughtrade said:

So, this is like someone born in America but not knowing where the next state is or what their religion is or how to work a toilet?

 

Some basic campaign information should be available to everyone. And a scholarly wizard should know more.

Despite terrible myths to the contrary, the average medieval peasant knew that the earth was round, spoke multiple languages, and knew both christian religion basics but also could tell you local tales of nature spirits and old gods of their homeland. They knew foreign lands; if for no other reason than their local rulers wanted to rile them up as levies when they went to war. Gota keep your troops mad at someone.

It's going to be awesome.

[farothel]

I would keep the ad itself short. Like Cailano's Alien example. But I would add somewhere that it's based on <<whatever you base it on>> so people can google it if they need more information. And if it's based off something, in the OOC of the character creation I would put in some links (or make a resources tab) to official sites, wiki's or the like where people can go if they need/want more information (for character ideas, a location their character grew up on and need more information about, etc.).

[cailano]

I should add that I believe in telling the players what type of game you're running, but that's separate from lore. For example, in my upcoming Barrowmaze recruitment, I tell the players exactly what type of campaign to expect. I don't tell them much about the setting or its history, but I do give them the campaign hook.

[OzzyKP]

17 hours ago, Roughtrade said:

So, this is like someone born in America but not knowing where the next state is or what their religion is or how to work a toilet?

 

Some basic campaign information should be available to everyone. And a scholarly wizard should know more.

Despite terrible myths to the contrary, the average medieval peasant knew that the earth was round, spoke multiple languages, and knew both christian religion basics but also could tell you local tales of nature spirits and old gods of their homeland. They knew foreign lands; if for no other reason than their local rulers wanted to rile them up as levies when they went to war. Gota keep your troops mad at someone.

 

Agreed.

[cailano]

27 minutes ago, OzzyKP said:

 

Agreed.

Yeesh, you guys are ganging up to bash my idea. But I still think it can work. I'm excited to try it.

I'll report back and let you know how it went.