Group-centric CharGen

[coreal]

2 hours ago, Ryfte said:

Does that cost 4 End for every single phase (i.e. 48 end a round, 12 phases x 4 End) or is it just 4 End per round? I know that with an attack power its per attack / use but I'm uncertain about this usage.

Yes, it costs 4 END for every phase.  But a Phase is only a character's action segment, not each segment in a turn.  

Ex. if you have speed 4,  you would have 4 phases in the 12 segment turn.  You would pay the end cost each phase, so 4x4, 16 end per turn.  

Yes, this means someone moving at a higher speed will spend more end to maintain a power over the same amount of time. 

If that seems prohibitive, you might want to consider the advantage 'costs end only to activate' which I think is a 1/4. 

[Zelphas]

Lamplighter has a serviceable sheet up now, I think! Thanks again, @coreal, for basically doing all of the work turning my ideas into actual, usable stats and data.

[Ryfte]

Can someone explain exactly what Hydrokinesis is actually used for? As far as I can tell it basically lets you move water around... but... nothing else. Why?

Edit: At first I thought it was a catch all that allowed telekinesis basically having a descriptive effect of things being manipulated by water. I was wrong of course, lol.

Edited April 6, 2023 by Ryfte (see edit history)

[eltorin]

14 minutes ago, Ryfte said:

Can someone explain exactly what Hydrokinesis is actually used for? As far as I can tell it basically lets you move water around... but... nothing else. Why?

Edit: At first I thought it was a catch all that allowed telekinesis basically having a descriptive effect of things being manipulated by water. I was wrong of course, lol.

Slightly paraphrasing from the book: "The character can pick up water. He/she can pick up as much as 400 kg of it without ever touching it, hurl it at people, shape it into simple forms or letters, and so forth." It's base is indeed TK. Essentially, by moving it around, you can use it as a weapon, or a form of communication and such, but 400 kg of water is a substantial enough mass that if you hit someone with it, probably gets knocked out for a while.

Sorry, just a comment from the bench. :)

Edited April 6, 2023 by eltorin (see edit history)

[Ryfte]

I know, but... what use is that? Ever? I mean, why not just use normal telekinesis and do the same thing? 😄

[eltorin]

Flavour..? Think of Aquaman, I guess (he can command water, but doesn't have standard TK,, hence the limitation).

Edited April 6, 2023 by eltorin (see edit history)

[coreal]

3 minutes ago, Ryfte said:

I know, but... what use is that? Ever? I mean, why not just use normal telekinesis and do the same thing? 😄

Well, in mechanics terms, buying hydrokinesis is cheaper than normal telekinesis.  You'd basically buy TK with the limitation 'usable on liquids only' -1/4, or 'usable on water only' -1/2 .  

[Ryfte]

Well... that's the thing... if you want a water blast its, well, water blast. If you want current manipulation its... well... current manipulation. The point being that any actual "effective" water ability is covered by a ton of other powers. It seems like "water tk" is sort of a "fluff" power that let's you, and I quote directly from the power:

" The character can control water. He can pick up as much as 400 kg of it without touching it, hurl it at people, shape it into simple forms or letters, and so forth."

There's nothing about using it as a weapon or doing anything other than basically cosmetic uses at all and the other powers handle snuffing out fires or causing electrical short circuits, etc. This one literally seems like its a power that should be a 3 point Perk or Talent. It doesn't even let you lift a volume of water based on the strength of the power, its a fixed amount, which is also silly. *shrug*

Edit: I mean, you win the super soaker contest and write fun water bubble messages in the air for 20 cps, really?

Edited April 6, 2023 by Ryfte (see edit history)

[eltorin]

Well, "hurl it at people" is using it as a weapon..Hero is like that, if you have the power to do that, you can do that, if not, you can't, it's not the system of power stunts. :)

Edited April 6, 2023 by eltorin (see edit history)

[Ryfte]

Hurling water at anything does 1 thing, gets it wet. Hydrokinesis is a constant ability as opposed to an instant and its not a "damaging" power as its written. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be able to do that, but its certainly not part of the power as its been written. "Hurling" water at a target to deal damage is quite literally what water blast does. Thus my confusion, in general, about it. I mean, its a "neat" idea but I'm missing the functional uses other than quite literally moving water around. So, uh, cleanup on aisle seven Aquaman, cleanup on aisle seven. 😉

Edit: I want to like it, and use it, I just can't justify the points for what it does, lol.

Edited April 6, 2023 by Ryfte (see edit history)

[eltorin]

I'm not arguing, just trying to help. :) Btw, by definition, you can use TK for damage: "The character can move, damage, and otherwise manipulate objects without having to physically touch them. He can even perform fine work, like typing or playing the piano (assuming he knows how to do those things)."

Edited April 6, 2023 by eltorin (see edit history)

[Ryfte]

4 hours ago, eltorin said:

I'm not arguing, just trying to help. 🙂 Btw, by definition, you can use TK for damage: "The character can move, damage, and otherwise manipulate objects without having to physically touch them. He can even perform fine work, like typing or playing the piano (assuming he knows how to do those things)."

Oh, certainly. I'm not in the least getting irritated / offended / etc. I'm simply trying to understand. I appreciate everyone's responses and feedback, have at it! 😉

If this was the case, if it acted like regular TK but using water, then it shouldn't be granted a "-1/2 affects water only" modifier though because technically you'd simply be using TK with a water effect, making it cheaper than normal TK but still being able to use it in exactly the same way. Based on how its written you can push water around but you're not changing the properties of the water itself, at any point in time, its still just a puddle of water. All the water powers also allow you to create the water for their usage (unless you take a limitation that requires water in the environment to use) so you could literally create the water you push around as well.

[coreal]

Now if it is like regular TK with a water effect,  then you're always blasting water about to do things.  With the affects water only limitation... you'd have to have the water already around to pick up and do things with.  Stuck in the Sahara with no water? No TK, except for what you can get out of a canteen's worth.

[Ryfte]

Actually... nope...

"In most cases, characters with Water Powers can create or generate their own water. If they must draw on outside sources of water to “fuel” their powers, the GM may allow a -¼ Limitation, Requires Nearby Source Of Water. For the purposes of this Limitation"

RAW, they could do the same thing in a desert, lol. That's in the general rules for water powers in the beginning of the section. *shrug*

Edited April 7, 2023 by Ryfte (see edit history)

[Papa Bear]

A lot of Champions is about the 'special effects' that define the powers.  All of our character can have the Blast Power, but the SFX make each character's version of Blast different (Fire Bird shoot flame from her hand, Magnet Man shoots out waves of magnetism, Lady Lightning calls down lightning bolts, etc).  Telekinesis is one of the most useful powers in Champions; you can manipulate object and attack with the same power (as mentioned, there's no 'power stunts' in this system)  Hydro-kinesis just does it with water instead of some unknown force (and you get to save some points!)

Edited April 7, 2023 by Papa Bear (see edit history)