Recruitment Questions/Chat

[TheFred]

For questions and stuff.

Recruitment is open until (at least) 7th October. I'll let everyone know if I need to extend it or whatever.

Edited September 23, 2023 by TheFred (see edit history)

[Rakle]

Precise Shot has PBS as a preq. Do the following rules seem to imply that PBS is no longer required to take precise shot?

• Point Blank Shot still exists, but you can use Precise Shot as a prereq for basically everything which requires it.
• Point Blank Master can be taken if you have Point Blank Shot (but not Precise Shot), rather than needing Weapon Specialisation.
•  

[TheFred]

Yeah, I'll add that.

[jkason]

The western puts me in mind of vultures / crows circling in the desert sky. Would you be open to a Stix PC?

[TheFred]

Strix? Sure. They're a bit unusual, but totally legal... I would maybe be a little concerned about them getting racial flight at all with no restrictions because that's powerful at low levels (however much you pay for it), but we're at L3 here not L1 and (perhaps more importantly) everyone is using guns, so I don't think you get that much of a free ride.

Obviously, for anyone thinking of something esoteric or unusual, it's on you to make it fit the theme and setting (with the setting being Golarion - albeit a little reimagined - that's not too hard, though).

[KingGoblin]

What are the already playing players playing? Like, character classes/roles/races or such?

 

Edit: oh, I see now, missed the link to the game in the old site.

Edited September 25, 2023 by KingGoblin (see edit history)

[Steel Warrior]

I was looking into this, wondering if you would consider this brawler archetype. I am also considering just the Fighter (Trench Fighter)
Planning on Trench Fighter 3, and then go into the the brawler archetype if permitted.

I would like to request the 3.5 feat Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting( Complete Adventurer, p. 111)
[Fighter Bonus Feat, General]

You are adept at wielding larger than normal weapons in your off hand.
Prerequisite

Two-Weapon Fighting (PH) , STR 13,
Benefit

When wielding a one-handed weapon in your off hand, you take penalties for fighting with two weapons as if you were wielding a light weapon in your off hand (see page 160 of the Player's Handbook).
Special

A fighter may select Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting as one of his fighter bonus feats. and finally the PF Feat Double SliceDouble Slice (Combat)

Your off-hand weapon while dual-wielding strikes with greater power.

Prerequisite: Dex 15, Two-Weapon Fighting.

Benefit: Add your Strength bonus to damage rolls made with your off-hand weapon.

Normal: You normally add only half of your Strength modifier to damage rolls made with a weapon wielded in your off-hand. could it also apply to Dex based damage.

Edited September 25, 2023 by Steel Warrior (see edit history)

[jkason]

I haven’t played in a firearms game before, so just making sure I have the basics. Looking them over, it looks like the main differences for firearms are:

 

1) they ignore armor / target touch AC up to a certain range. But they don’t COUNT as touch attacks.
 

2) They almost all have a high crit modifier (looks like they’re most / all x4)

 

3) They can misfire on low rolls and then need repairing.
 

I think point 1 is the only thing I need to be extra sure of. Am looking at the Invulnerable Rager archetype, so I wanted to make sure I understand correctly so I don’t invest in an ability all the guns would ignore anyway. :)

[Steel Warrior]

3 minutes ago, jkason said:

I haven’t played in a firearms game before, so just making sure I have the basics. Looking them over, it looks like the main differences for firearms are:

 

1) they ignore armor / target touch AC up to a certain range. But they don’t COUNT as touch attacks.
 

2) They almost all have a high crit modifier (looks like they’re most / all x4)

 

3) They can misfire on low rolls and then need repairing.
 

I think point 1 is the only thing I need to be extra sure of. Am looking at the Invulnerable Rager archetype, so I wanted to make sure I understand correctly so I don’t invest in an ability all the guns would ignore anyway. :)

Invulnerable rager gives DR 1 / - every even level. So you would only have DR 1/- on all physical attacks, unless there was a special ability to ignore damage reduction.

Damage Reduction is not an AC bonus like armor or natural armor, so there should be no conflict there.

[jkason]

29 minutes ago, Steel Warrior said:

Invulnerable rager gives DR 1 / - every even level. So you would only have DR 1/- on all physical attacks, unless there was a special ability to ignore damage reduction.

Damage Reduction is not an AC bonus like armor or natural armor, so there should be no conflict there.

Ah. Okay, I thought touch attacks bypassed DR, which was why I wanted to make sure guns use touch AC but don’t count as touch attacks, but I’m still getting my feet re-wet after a long break, so I could have that all mixed up.

[TheFred]

16 hours ago, Steel Warrior said:

I was looking into this, wondering if you would consider this brawler archetype. I am also considering just the Fighter (Trench Fighter)
Planning on Trench Fighter 3, and then go into the the brawler archetype if permitted.

I would like to request the 3.5 feat Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting( Complete Adventurer, p. 111)
[Fighter Bonus Feat, General]

You are adept at wielding larger than normal weapons in your off hand.
Prerequisite

Two-Weapon Fighting (PH) , STR 13,
Benefit

When wielding a one-handed weapon in your off hand, you take penalties for fighting with two weapons as if you were wielding a light weapon in your off hand (see page 160 of the Player's Handbook).
Special

A fighter may select Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting as one of his fighter bonus feats. and finally the PF Feat Double SliceDouble Slice (Combat)

Your off-hand weapon while dual-wielding strikes with greater power.

Prerequisite: Dex 15, Two-Weapon Fighting.

Benefit: Add your Strength bonus to damage rolls made with your off-hand weapon.

Normal: You normally add only half of your Strength modifier to damage rolls made with a weapon wielded in your off-hand. could it also apply to Dex based damage.

Is there a reason to do all of that rather than just take a level in actual Gunslinger? Under Guns Everywhere, Gunslingers get Gun Training at L1 (beating out Trench Fighters) as well as grit and stuff. Is there something in particular that the Brawler archetype gives you that you can't get that way?

I think Double Slice would apply to Dex-based damage if you had an effect which replaced your Str with your Dex for bonus damage, wouldn't it? It may depend on the specific ability - but it's quite hard to get Dex to damage whilst dual-wielding in PF at only L3.

3 hours ago, jkason said:

Ah. Okay, I thought touch attacks bypassed DR, which was why I wanted to make sure guns use touch AC but don’t count as touch attacks, but I’m still getting my feet re-wet after a long break, so I could have that all mixed up.

No, touch attacks bypass some AC bonuses (armour, shield, natural armour), but not DR. Guns I think don't count as touch attacks for Deadly Aim specifically, though in most other cases it doesn't actually matter.

Because for this game specifically we're using advanced firearms, misfiring is also less of an issue (though it is still an issue).

[LAVRENCE]

is ammo for firearms at 10% of cost also?

[TheFred]

Yes.

[Steel Warrior]

5 hours ago, TheFred said:

Is there a reason to do all of that rather than just take a level in actual Gunslinger? Under Guns Everywhere, Gunslingers get Gun Training at L1 (beating out Trench Fighters) as well as grit and stuff. Is there something in particular that the Brawler archetype gives you that you can't get that way?

I think Double Slice would apply to Dex-based damage if you had an effect which replaced your Str with your Dex for bonus damage, wouldn't it? It may depend on the specific ability - but it's quite hard to get Dex to damage whilst dual-wielding in PF at only L3.

No, touch attacks bypass some AC bonuses (armour, shield, natural armour), but not DR. Guns I think don't count as touch attacks for Deadly Aim specifically, though in most other cases it doesn't actually matter.

Because for this game specifically we're using advanced firearms, misfiring is also less of an issue (though it is still an issue).

The Trench Fighter archetype can stack with Eldritch Guardian (familiar)
The familiar with the figment archetype will come back if killed, has 1/4 hp but, it also has 1 evolution point at 3rd. I gave it the 1d6 bleed.
The brawler archetype gives me the Point Blank Master feat regardless if I meet the prerequisites at 2nd level. Also it still provides unarmed strike.
 

[TheFred]

Well, yeah, if that's what you want to do.

I'd prefer not to dip into 3rd party archetypes if we can help it. You can already get PBM if you really want it, after all. Since that's post-L3, though, I guess we don't need to make a final decision right now, not if it doesn't impact on you too much at the moment; I wouldn't rule it out, anyway.

Oversized TWF should be fine to be honest; if you're planning to dual-wield guns, well, that's unlikely to be overpowered, let's be honest.